My wife has a '77 Firebird with a 231ci odd fire V6. The motor has seen better days and needs replacing. She can't drive it anymore now. Lucky for her I have a '91 Firebird for parts sitting in my backyard. It has a 3.1 liter V6, multipoint EFI and an overdrive (4L60E?) trans. What I'm going to do is pll the motor out of the '91 Firebird and drop it in the '77 one along with the overdrive transmission. Better fuel economy and more power. What more could you ask for.

Well that's what you would think. She is however after a bit more power than the 140 HP that the 3.1 puts out. How do these motors withstand turbo's? Are they any good? Or will it explode at the hint of being boosted? I won't be doing this right away, but maybe in the future. Just looking for info so I can prepare for it. Wanna have my Dart running first before I start turboing the wife's car. What's the thoughts on using the stock EFI? To get my wife's car running again as soon as possible I'll be using the stock ECM and wiring loom from the '91 Firebird, but I can imagine it won't suffice later on when going boosted.

 

If it's a 91 it will be a 700R4. That's better for you. Use a stock box now and add a Megasquirt later. Rebuild the transmission to V8 spec when you get the chance and it will take quite a bit of power. Throw a stock GN turbo on it along with some GN or 3800 series II/III injectors (36lb/hr) and it will be a fairly stout combo for what it is. JMO If you want easy go get a 4.3L V6 TBI engine and put it in. That would likely be a bolt in installation, use your old transmission etc. etc. The other thing is take the 229 and try to find someone with Syclone or Typhoon to buy it because that's an odd fire engine the crank "may" be valuable to them. They are stronger than the split journal cranks that came in the "even fire" 4.3Ls.

 

Over here in Holland the availability of or sorts of different engines is limited and normally sell for too much money if people do have them and they know you want or need it. We can't just go to the local salvage yard and score neat stuff. What we have is usually in peoples sheds and then the prices are different.

What you siad about converting to Megasquirt later on was something that had crossed my mind too. The old transmission in the '77 is a three speed and I like the option of having an overdrive once the other motor is in, so I will exchange the complete set up.

The GN parts sound interesting. I don't suppose exhaust manifolds will bolt up to the 3.1 will they? That would make life too easy.

 

No GN manifolds won't bolt up but they actually did make a factory tubro 3.1L but they are RARE. Even in the states. If you are lucky you may be able to find some sort of tubular manifolds for that engine or a set of FWD manifolds that would work for your setup. A lot of manifolds should bolt up from various FWD and RWD cars. This includes 2.8, 3.1 and 3.4L stuff.

I didn't realize you were in Europe. By all means that would be a serviceable setup for your second gen. The reason I mentioned GN parts is that they're cheap in the states. You could probably get to a bit over 300hp with stock GN injectors which would be a good start for you. JMO sell the ECU and get a Megasquirt. You will be happier in the long run. It wouldn't be too hard to get that engine to work well with the MS either.

 

I was looking through some wiring diagrams the other night and I think I saw that the lockup and 4th gear is controlled by the ecu. What happens when I go for Megasquirt? Will I still be able to control this?

 

Oh, and I think the wife would be more than happy for a while with around 300hp.

 

Megasquirt has mods for the L/U or you can do it with some basic electronics. #ad
I *NEVER* tested this so I disclaim myself in that regard, however in theory it should work. The vacuum switch is what was used on cars back in the day to actuate L/U before they had ECUs (think TH-350Cs.)

 

Hey Alain,
Ask Auto/Part in Den Dolder.
Last time i was there they had a few turbo's from the 3.8's
Maybe they can help you with some more issues like the manifolds.
Oh and tell them what you're going to do, they like special projects.

Succes met je project...

 

If it already has a 231 why not find a used grandnational 3.8 it would bolt right in. Throw the 3.1 away. I own a used car lot and i stay away from the pos 3.1 s they are junk.

 

229=! Buick. That is a closer relative of the 4.3L V6 Chevy.

 

Thanx, but like I already said, it's not easy finding used stuff over here for reasonable prices. Seeing as I'm on a tight budget (want to get my Dart running before I turbo this Firebird), I have a complete and running 3.1 in a '91 Firebird parts car in the yard, I think that will be my easiest option. Later on, once my Dart is running, I'll turbo the wife's Firebird. Just gathering info and opinions at this point as I don't like to just dive head first into things. Want to have enough info before I start spending the cash and even worse.........doing the work! :lh:

 

Thanx for the diagram DracOnic.

 

Thanx for the tip F20A2-T. Will look into it.



Edit: Looked at your profile and just realised who you are Been quite a while ago since we spoke when I was picking up spark plugs for my '69 Camaro.

 

Was a bit too much work to drop in the 3.1, so have decided to just stick to the 231 odd fire motor for now (have enough on my hands). She blows a puff of smoke now and then and mainly when standing still and revving/raising the rpm's. Don't really know what's causing this. Under driving conditions, the smoke is minimal. When I had the heads off a while ago, I did see that the number 6 cylinder had some rough spots in the cylinder wall, but can't really figure why that would cause it to blow smoke mainly when the motor is not loaded and running above idle.

Oh well, this odd fire motor is more fun than the 3.1 would be. May see if I can pick up some stuff to turbocharge it if I make it out to The States for the World Street Nats in October/November again this year.