I just picked up my wagon from the dyno shop and it still Detonates and makes a max boost of 9 lbs it only makes 350hp and 450 ft of torque.... I still have major problems with this motor.... I am at a total loss. I might as well just put a carb on it and throw the turbos away and it may make 550hp?????/ WTF... I hate this car....



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Holy crap man. Thats a bummer. Something is seriously off. What is the timing set to at peak torque at 9psi?

If you were to lock the wastegates open and run 0psi, can you tune it to not detonate in NA form?

 

It supposedly was set to a total of 9 deg. of timing at 9 lbs of boost and still knocked its ass off. ????????? I now have $350 in tuning and I am no closer to having a driveable car.

 

Have you verified TDC with an indicator on a piston against your balancer markings? What is your base timing at idle?

 

where did they start the timing at? at 9* there is good possibility of it knocking due to not enough timing, that is super low man. What turbos are on the car? We just ran into this issue with mine, we couldnt make any more than 12psi, turns out it just couldnt control boost on compressor psi and we added co2 to the system to keep the gates closed and problems solved.

Anthony

 

Also, try and get some type of converter slip #'s, that can skew your dyno readings greatly.

 

I haven't looked at the timing graph yet to see what they set things too. " Just too pissed at the moment" as for converter it has a 2400 stall. as for boost with this motor 9 psi is a lot. with a 4.5 bore and a 4.5 stroke 9 psi is plenty to make HP with. as for static timing I have not checked to see that TDC is really TDC but idle timing is set at 10 deg. This system does use a map sensor and retards the timing under boost. IT does have a normal timing curve unboosted.

T.H.

 

That car is nice. Keep working on the bugs it will be worth it in the end.

 

You need to list every single aspect of the heads, cam, engine, rotating assembly, etc etc before we can help you. Something is VERY wrong. We can help you figure it out but you have to start being extremely specific. You have any pictures of the heads, shortblock etc etc that will help too.

 

I will try to get a list of things together and pics and see if I can get some ideas here. Maybe a cam timing issue or ??

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Here is a list of specs for this build.
Pistons

PROBE RACING COMPONENTS 12330-030

BBF DISHED SRS PISTON SET 4.390'' BORE -22CC Part Number: 12330 1.350" Compression Height 4.300/4.500" Stroke 6.800/6.700" Rod Length 0.990" Pin OD 1/16 in. 1/16 in. 3/16 in. Rings

cam: Comp cam 34-254-5 Adv Dir. 298/316 at .50 254/264 and valve lift 585/588 and a 112 LSA
Heads:

PC3051B Specs:	Flow #'s:
Intake Port Volume	300cc	Intake Flow	Exhaust Flow
Combustion Chamber	95cc	.100	59.8	.100	48.0
Intake Valve Size	2.08"	.200	115.0	.200	98.0
Exhaust Valve Size	1.71"	.300	172.0	.300	125.0
Valve Stem Diameter	11/32"	.400	243.0	.400	158.0
Intake Port Size	1.875" W x 2.25" T	.500	302.0	.500	186.0
Exhaust Port Size	1.375" W x 1.8125" T	.600	322.0	.600	195.0
Max Spring Diameter	1.550"	.700	330.0	.700	203.0
Weight Turbos Compressor Inlet 4" Compressor Outlet 2.5" Bearing Wet Floating Bearings Cooling Oil + Water Oil Cooling Fitting 1/8" NPT Feeding. M8 x1.25 Return Flange Mounting Screws Water Cooling Fitting M16 Threaded Flange Standard T4 HP Rating 500-700 HP Internal Wastegate None Compressor 72mm Wheel Compressor Turbine P Trim .96 A/R Turbine Compressor Wheel 102.4mm/72.1mm Turbine Wheel 74.1mm/64.6mm Hot Side 3" V-band ARP studs for heads and mains copper head gaskets .043 thick Torker 2 intake 80lb injectors stock cast exhaust manifolds 50mm wastegate 50mm BOV timing gears set set to "0" no advance or retard. Hyd lifters & 3/8 hardened pushrods 75mm tb high flow intercooler 3in and 3in out stock ford dizzy from a 351c with a 460 cam gear on it SDS injection system 9 lbs of boost max. 60psi fuel pressure weldon EFI fuel pump 125 max psi and 1200lb of fuel per hr max flow	28lbs

 

That engine should make more power NA, than it did on 9 lbs. What was the A/F? Timing should be higher, to me...

 

heads pics

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The tuner couldn't tell you if he had any ideas what was wrong with it? Thats and awful sharp edge on those valave reliefs, but I am no expert.

What spark plugs?

 

He's been working the same issues for over a year and keeps throwing money at it. We need to try to help him, if it was me I might have run the car off a bridge already.

 

I had a friend with a 70 cuda put a after market timing tape on backwards. When we tried to set the timing it would run like crap. When you would tune it by ear it was something like 4 degrees retarded. Had a hell of a time trying to figure it out. Stay after it. It will be something easy. Good luck, be safe.

 

Couple questions:
1. Did the tuner tell you what AFR he was targeting and able to acheive?
2. What does the post-turbo exhaust comprise of?
3. How is the current response off boost?

 

Just spit balling but I'd try a straight up 429 or 460 dizzy it might be the problem something is messing up in the 351c converted one? Do the heads lift under pressure? That shop shoulda called you to be there to view it for yourself man. That is pretty shotty on their end. Have you ever atomized a fluid in the injector bosses to make sure you are getting even spray across the board? Or to even make sure all injectors are firing and seeing same signal? And I completely agree with yourself and others that motor as is, should be well over that mark NA form. Have there been any vacuum leaks? Shit man I might try blow through to see if you get same results if I were you... just something to compare it to ya know? If this is keeping you stumped and you keep getting to pissed.
My thoughts are, the dizzy might be the problem and perhaps the gear some how lifted and skipped a few teeth maybe? I don't know, what made you put a 351c converted in it in the first place? I didn't realize they were the same or could be used. lol Cool I would definitely degree that cam in though, did you use a timing wheel? There is a few questions to start off with.

 

9.7 compression is roughly what I'm getting, which isn't ideal but with an intercooler, 9psi shouldn't rattle at 9º.

 

Yes it looks like the comp is 9.66 to 1 I dont think that would make for the major problems this motor has. As for the dizzy I had to use the 351 and change out the gear for the SDS injection system to be able to read the signal correctly for the SDS . It's what I was told to do....