What do you guys think about poor mans ceramic coating (header wrap)? I am kinda leaning toward using the black wrap on my headers.. What do you guys think?


Jeremy

 

Here is what I am dealing with..
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So what's the problem, a child behind the wheel of a 1000hp Mustang?

Header wrap deteriorates over time, it also holds in moisture which can result in corrosion of your hot side components.

I've used it on a N/A setup and I felt it was a waste of money once it began to fall apart (less than 1 year later.)

 

I also say nay. I don't like the look and I hate what it does to the pies under wraps. It kills them in no time flat. I would coat it with some VHT High Temt ceramic stuff. I used it on my pipes and I am still amazed with how well it turned out.

 

Thats whats on my headers now... It has all burned off (actually flaked off) at the collector though Maybe I need to apply a couple of coats. I am going to use BBQ paint next time around.


Jeremy

 

Really? I haev had mine glowing and they are still looking great. I took them down to bare metal, scuffed them up, wiped em with prepsall and shot many light coats. Probably 3-4 light coats on it all. You can see where I got it too thick, it kinda look bubbled up, but still holding on great.

Was it the 2000* paint???

 

Here's mine after the HR Power Tour. @3000 miles of heat, traffic, rain and BS.

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it's all in the surface prep.

 

I used wrap on my last setup and had no problems!!

 

here is my 2 cents: and this is not based on the fact that I sell the product. I sell the product becuase of my experience with it.

I have seen good wrap jobs and bad wrap jobs. As in everything in life, prep and proper assembly is the key.

If you wrap regular non-aluminized mild steel that is most likely already rusting then yes over time it will continue to rust.

If you wrap aluminized or coated pipes it will last for years with no problem. I wrapped a crossover pipe on my buddies turbostang daily driver in 1997, that crossover pipe isn't even aluminized, just nasty mild steel and is still there. It hasn't crumbled into dust or fallen off the car to this day.

The wrap does not deteriorate if used properly. There is a spray coating that you SHOULD use when wrapping pipes to protect it from oil spills, or cleaning solutions, transmission fluid, brake fluid... you get the picture. The wrap will start to come apart if it is chaffing against something but any coating would also scratch away over time if the pipe was rubbing on something. I have nothing against coatings, my turbo kit was Jet-Hot coated and I loved it.

There is a ton of mis-information out there about header wrap, someone in an earlier post even made the statement that it was made from Esbestos!!!!!!!!! Wouldn't that be a law suit waiting to happen? The wrap is not for everybody, some like it and some hate it. Thats fine but lets not blame the wrap for rusty pipes, up until cars starting coming with stainless or aluminized exhaust systems my buddy's exhaust shop saw dozens of cars a day come in with exhaust systems rusting off the car..... they weren't wrapped. just poor quality metal.

 

I'm a big believer in header wrap.. I used it for many years on my supercharged setup.. On it I had my exhaust wrapped all the way pass the X pipe under the car.. I don't see how that stuff could hold mositure.. It's not like this stuff runs cold.. And it did a ton for holding down under hood heat..

My concern about doing my turbo setup is.. Maybe all the added heat that stays in the pipes will damage the turbo :shrug:..

 

header wrap

i voted yes, basicly as good as paint may stick it cant insulate for shit, i will always say buy the best you can and if ceramic coating is out of reach but wrap is affordable then it would be my preference. For the cost it is cheap insulation and with some care can last a while, ie dont wash your engine bay then put the car away with out driving around the block to heat the pipes and wrap to dry the wrap and so on, but bear in mind, wrap has one distinct disadvantage compared to ceramic coating or bare pipes, it holds a hell of alot of heat in the pipe, where as ceramic coating reflects it away from the pipe and uncoated allows air flow to reduce pipe temp the wrapped pipe will run alot hotter so if your wrapping mild steel pipes that are less than 2mm thick you would be advised to make sure your turbo is supported well as red hot mild isnt very good at supporting a few pounds without help.

and ontop of that we all no the more heat you keep in the pipe work before the turbo the quicker the response. I for one would give the wrap a go, just use common sense and you will be fine.

cheers

 

the wrap does hold heat very well. but it does not increase the amount of heat in the pipe. if your EGT's are 1300* then that is how hot your pipes will be regardless of wrap or not. It's just that the wrap will hold the temp longer than exposed piping.

 

I wrapped my down pipe, it really helps in keeping the heat away from the wires and I sealed the wrap with a high temp coating. It looks almost as good as the day I put it on two years ago.

 

Hmm... that's not too bad of an idea. How many miles have you logged with the PTK kit on? My headers have faded to shit, but yours look virtually new. I've got probably around 20k miles on mine. Also, what are the brand on the plug-wire protectors you've got on there?

You can PM me as to not hijack this thread, if you wish.

Thx

 

I coated mine with ceramic paint then wraped them in header wrap, and then wound a stainless steel wire around it all. It's been more then a year now and it's holding up perfectly. The wire really helps keep the wrap as tight as possible to the header and prevents the ends from wanting to unravel. I used the black header wrap, and it is starting to fade, but other than that I love it. It really helps keep down heat soak in the engine bay.

 

wrap

actualy Dman i think you will find it does make a difference, for instance call EGTs a constant 1000deg, and pour cold water over the pipe, how hots the pipe? now consider that the water was just a denser cooling medium than air so it was able to cool the pipe down a heap, the air moving around the pipe does the same thing, remove the conductors means of conducting (air in contact) and you remove its ability to absorb or transfer heat, hence the overall operating temp of the pipe goes up, and by removing the cooling mediums means of heat absorbtion you will retain a greater amount of overall heat in the pipe which again adds a small amount of extra heat that the pipe will have to endure. At the end of the day an air cooled pipe will tolerate heat better than a pipe with no cooling, but in the scheme of things id rather keep many other things in my engine bay cool and use the wrap or preferably ceramic coating to achieve this, but the fact remains that there are some negatives to using wrap, but nothing that cant be overcome with some thought


cheers

 

Re: wrap

You assume that a mild steel or stainless pipe _needs_ to be cooled though. I think I would tend to agree with dman here. The actual EGT's should be the same. We arent talking about heated air that is being held still in a tube, its passing through rather quickly. The surface of the metal on the outside will be slightly lower without wrap because of the transference of energy from the inside of the pipe to the outside, but I would imagine the entropy would be contained in the metal itself given the heat and speed of the air exiting from the chamber. The wrap would (in my mind) help preserve the life of the metal (if rust and corrosion is taken out of the equasion) since the entropy from one side of the metal to the other side isnt as extreme with the wrap on the outside of the pipe.

Just my 2 cents.

-Jason

 

Re: wrap

i completely agree that the wrap holds in more heat than a bare pipe. What I ment was the wrapped pipe won't get any hotter than the heat source (exhaust). It will just contain it longer. which is the idea behind wrapping.

 

wrap

i think we are all agreeing basicly, but the my point was made mainly with respect to the fact that by wrapping a set of pipes that inadequately support the turbo its possible to hold that much heat in the pipe work that the weight of the turbo can wreck a mild steel turbo manifold thats made from thin gauge tube if precautions are taken to add support, which was what i originaly was trying to convey, obviously if a manifold was made from 2mm or thicker steel this isnt a problem, but many people use 1.4-1.6mm steel and this is where problems with wrap can arise if adequate support isnt given to the turbo

cheers