Hi guys,
I have a 1971 tube frame Indy car with a stock block 5.0 HO Ford engine. I have some basic turbo questions and am looking for help. Car weighs 1350 lbs. Has a 2 speed manual transaxle. Will run on gas. I bought a low mileage 1990 engine, stock heads, bottom end. Here are some of the other parts. Shorty headers which i have revearsed from side to side and flipped up so it will have a crossover pipe behind the engine and then y into the turbo, so turbo will be behind engine and manifold high, plenty of room. Demon 650 blow thru carb, msd ignition that will retard timing as pressure increases. Im trying to make 400-450 hp, run under 6000 rpm. Told I only need to run 7-8 lbs of boost. Again told these numbers are easy to achieve. No intercooler. This thing will only run parade laps at about 100-y120 mph. Want to run a budget turbo, any suggestions as to what turbo and how to set it up?? Also what distributor?? Plugs? Timing? What about wastegate?? I know nothing about turbos, any advice??? Thanks in advance.

 

Sounds like a sweet project, please post pics!

As for your questions, be prepared to run 8psi on 93 octane from a 66-70mm T-series T4 turbo for ease. Oil lubricated and with no water cooling. A lot of cheap stuff from china will be okay here for 200-300 bucks unless you want something a little higher quality like a Magnum Performance Turbo, Borg Warner, or Precision. Not really a need for your goal though.

You can use an MSD mechanical advance dizzy and 6-BTM combo for timing control. Some people will lock the advance at 20°-25° or so, then pull 1° per lb of boost, but you can also just let the mechanical advance do it's thing so you have proper ignition curve outside of boost, then pull 2.5°-3° per lb. This is probably the route I would choose.

For stock heads use an autolite 24 (copper) plug. This is 1 step colder than stock with the correct reach. Gap it at .024 for this combo for starters. Should be fine.

For wastegate and blow off valve, lots of people are having success with the "WyntonM" products on ebay. Wastegate diameter around 40-46mm will be good, provided you place it well. should come with a 7-8psi spring so you shouldn't need a boost controller. if it makes less boost than desired, get a cheap manual controller and turn it up. Ensure your vacuum/boost plumbing to these two items is correct before romping on it or you may risk overboost and blown motors.

Send the carb off to Kevin at CSU for an easy blowthrough experience. he'll set it up, most likely dead on, to where you just drop it on and go. It's wise to take it to a dyno for double checking though. That's about all it takes if I remember correctly.

 

Pictures to come once i figure out how?

 

Thanks for the reply. Here are a few pics. Still need a distributor, what should I look for???? How many wires? Carb is a Demon 650 blow thru, will it work right out of the box??? I will be posting pictures as I go
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Looks sick! As for the dizzy, msd 8598, 8579 or anything for 302 with 2-wire VR pickup and steel gear. The old ford duraspark dizzy's have the 2-wire VR and can be set up for BTM control but i'm not as familiar with them so you'll have to research. it'd be the cheap option of the two, although the MSD dizzy can be had for around $150 new-ish

I have no idea how your carb was set up or if it was done right. With CSU, you tell them about your combo and goals, then Kevin sets the carb up and ships it to you so you just drop it on and do a few checks to dial it in.

 

Is there anyone in the North-central Indiana area that could help with set up??

 

Have a stock distributor, what about the vacume advance??

 

I forgot MSD lets you control the TFI (stock) dizzy as well. I haven't used this method myself but I'm sure it works..

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This turbo has ports for water cooling, is that mandatory? We have fuel pressure set on 7 lbs, boost set on 8 lbs Can we run the engine with out the turbo at idle with a blow thru carb?? Any words of advice??? View attachment 674046 #ad
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I'd say check with the manufacturing on whether water cooling is required. Often times it's not but some need it.

You can run the engine with no boost just fine, the blow through modification, from what i've read, only effects the carb when boost is added.

 

I thought i would post the outcome of our project. After applying the advice found here we took the car to Indiana Muscle Car and had the engine set up on their rear wheel dyno. Our figures were actual hp & torque figures measured at rear tires. We were not tuning for horsepower but rather just wanted to keep all our readings safe. After half a dozen pulls and a number of jet changes we ended up with 456 foot pounds of torque, 286 hp and 140 miles per hour in first gear @ 3200 rpm. We then took the car to a nearby airport to make some passes on the runway. This testing went well, so off to Indianapolis. We were able to run 2 sessions without trouble at the Historic Exhibition. They have a speed cap so most of our laps were in the 125 mph range. Keep in mind this is in first gear. Shifting into high gear would have likely given us the speed needed (170 mph laps speeds) to be period correct for 1971. All in all a huge success. Thanks to all on this board for advice.

 

Great to hear! did you have any pictures from the event? maybe some videos?

 

Not sure how to download the video. There is some on my face book page. But I'll try to post some pics. Turbo looks a little rusty in one pic. but we rubbed it down with WD 40 and it looked ok. Ended up only needing 6 lbs of boost and even then in testing it blew our little home made "hat" off the carb. We had to upgrade the stud to hold the pressure and that's at 6 lbs, what if we needed 12 or 15?

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the 286/456 numbers made me laugh. Not that that's bad or anything, I'm just trying to imagine that torque in a light racecar. Kind of like diesel engine numbers.

 

if you're ever afraid of the rusty turbine housing, you can have it ceramic coated for 30-50 bucks, which helps trap exhaust heat in (good thing) and also keeps it from oxidizing.

 

Thats a cool little racecar!! You can use VHT paint on the turbine housing it will last a while for 8 bucks a can.

 

With that hp/tq curve you definitely need more turbo. It looks like a t3/t4, do you have the specs on the turbo?

 

Yes, it is a T3, but dont know the specs. Just a cheap chinese turbo capable of 6-25 lbs of boost. Yes the numbers are out of whack but if we were able to get 3 sessions in at Indy that would only be about 90 miles so no need to go with an expensive set up. If you go to my Facebook page (mark klingerman) and scroll down there are several videos of the car running around the track. It was a FUN project!!

 

I didn't mean you had to go with an expensive setup, just that the numbers are the way they are because the turbo (especially the turbine) is small, and restrictive. It's efficient at peak tq rpm, but not at peak hp. A bump in turbo (even another China turbo) would gain you a bunch of hp, and actually run better as the back pressure/boost ratio is most likely very high with your current turbo.