hi guys and girls,

Im Jochen from the Netherlands. I just introduced myself in this topic:
https://www.theturboforums.com/thre...54-bbc-first-turbo-build.387058/#post-2040581

This is my first turbo build and I'm trying to keep it budget for now. Learning as much as I go forward.

This first build will be a single turbo build on my MKIV BBC in my 77 GMC Suburban. I have done some searching on the forum, trying to find builds that used the stock manifolfds, but I can only find twinturbo builds so far or single turbo builds that are far from stock ;-)

So I was hoping somebody could share either photos and info on using the stock log manifolds and/or topics that have info on them. Ive looked in my engine bay and because of my lack of experience it looks like mission impossible to me hahaha....

 

There are a ton of BBC manifolds, which ones are you trying to use (pictures help)?

 

Sorry B E N . Youre right. My world is focussed on the Suburban and thus trucks. These are the left and right stock manifolds.

problem is when I switch them left to right and vise versa, that the driverside (exiting down) will be 75% over the engine mount.

 

Well update on my project here. I did a some searching and read the toopics that B E N pointed me to:
https://www.theturboforums.com/thre...54-bbc-first-turbo-build.387058/#post-20406601977 GMC C15 Suburban - stock 454 BBC - first turbo build | Introduce Yourself (theturboforums.com)

flipping my stock manifolds isnt an option. The driverside manifold flipped to the passengerside will have its exit above the engine mount. So no way I can connect the hotside. So scratch that option.

then visited a friend that has a GenV hanging in the engine stand with shortys headers on it. We tried flipping them forward and down, but then they dont clear our Suburban chassis. So impossible. Then flipped them forward and up. But that is just stupid. The point up and outwards and just looks stupid and takes up far too much room.

I contacted Dave from this topic:
https://www.theturboforums.com/threads/target-boost.382535/#post-1990346
he has some nice looking forward pointing headers, that stay low and could be an option.
He sent me some more photos and the emailed a little back and forth. I came to the conclusion this might be an option, but I would probably have to raise the alternator (not to hard), but find a solution that would solve the PS pump. I checked with a friend if a PS pump with remopte reservoir would be an option, but we'd still have the pulley in the way of these headers. And dont want to move to any electrical PS pump or other special solutions, because its a budget build and not a straight racecar build ;-)

I then looked into remote turbo setup. big advantage is keeping stock headers in the engine bay, not needing an intercooler and keeping heat out of the engine bay. Cons are more piping under the car, oil scavenging pump, but worst is the turbo and wastegate will be in the waeather under the car. And I try to drive my suburban all year round. Some corrosion on the turbo I could handle. But dont want to blow up me engine from a corroded wastegate. So also not my first option.

The option I found, that would be really nice, is this option:
https://www.stainlessheaders.com/product/Modular_Big_Block_Chevy_single_Turbo_Header/

its perfect. But damn...starts at allmost $1000. Thats just too mich for my budget build. I wish I know how to tig weld, cause then I'd build my own set.

Then started browsing Ebay for BBC turbo headers and came across these ones from DNA Motoring:


I was afraid of the heat in the enginebay, but a friend told me that good heatwrap could prevent a lot of that.
I will use a 90 degree bent on one side. make hotside crossover dropdown and over and then connect it to the other side and put a T4 flange for the turbo there.


So thats it for now for the headers. Im gonna probably just order these and see how that works out.

I also got the intercooler in the mail today. Looks like a nice size when I held it in front of the grill

 

You could look at building a set of log manifolds, https://www.theturboforums.com/threads/show-us-your-log-style-headers.314354/

That must be a unique vehicle in the Netherlands!

 

hi B E N, yes it is. But on the other hand. I started a Suburban group on facebook in 2013 and it has over 800 memebers with suburbans. But yeas, on the streets they get a lot of attention. good and bad hahaha

Id love to build my own log headers to recreate the #1 option from "stainlessheaders" website. But I have little to no welding experience yet. Building my hotside will be my first exhaust welding. So welding my own headers feels like out of my reach. But Ill definately look into the topic you shared.

 

No better time to learn! Get a decent welder and a bunch of scrap material to practice on. Practice every day for a week or so on similar materials and then go to town. Worst case, you get it all tacked up into position and take it to a welder to finish.

 

You wil get there Jochen. Just like I did with my 454ss truck and remote turbo setup

 

thanks pavementpounder.

I ordered the up&forward headers and a wastegate and BOV. Next thing on my list are carb hat. Lots of possibilities. But I think I miht go with the Spectre hat. Always have liked the looks of it and its not to expensive.

 

Hi Jochen,
You've seen my single turbo 360 W200 at different meets, although that has been a while. It was a budget build and all up I think I spent around about €1000. I bought a HX-50 turbo from Marktplaats, used the stock manifolds and welded up some old exhaust pipe I had laying around to connect it all up. It wasn't anything fancy, just used a MIG welder.

Don't forget you need some way of pulling timing when you get into boost. I tried the locked-out distributor at first but soon realized that wasn't ideal when just cruising the highway. I bought a cheap boost referenced timing box from Summit Racing at the time ($189), but they haven't been available for years now. The only thing that comes close now is the MSD BTM box. It's a bit more expensive though.

Are you running LPG? Or gasoline?

 

Hi Alain, yes I remember that. I tried flipping the original manifolds or maybe even flip a couple of shorty headers, but it wouldnt fit. See my previous posts. These up&forward headers were not too bad and still keeps it a budget build.

I have convverted my big block to LPG vapour injection, no more gasoline, and controlling injection, timing and cooling fans with a Megasquirt MS3X ECU. Full sequential. I have been sharing my progress on my facebook project page .

My first focus now is to get this " strange fuel" LPG under control. There is just soo much stuff you can control and adjust and that influence fuel consumption and need with LPG. And everything seems to work different from gasoline. rich when cold, lean when warm. Vaporous versus liquid. Etc. But it starts easy now. Idles pretty good. Went for a small run around the block and next goal is to get gas, so goingn for a further drive. Hopefully not stalling in traffic hahaha...When I have this LPG injection tuning fully under control....and finished building my wifes Suburban...then Ill move forward on the turbo...pretty excited about that.

 

Always take a laptop with you when just converted to EFI! Haha. LPG vapor injection? Or direct liquid LPG injection?

There's a few key things to remember when turbocharging your car. Firstly make sure you have a good ignition system with plenty of spark and a reliable means of pulling timing under boost. Next, make sure your air/fuel ratio is good. If you're vaporizing LPG before injecting it, make sure to boost reference the regulator. Gap your piston rings to allow for higher temps without binding.

I haven't been on Facebook for a couple of years now (and don't miss it at all), so I haven't seen any of your pics. Keep us posted through this forum on your progression with the turbo project.

 

I have installed vapor injection. LPi would have been nicer, just too little information to be found.

I have bought a set of LS D585 truck coils to replace my single coil setup once I get the LPG fuel tuned. That should be plenty spark ;-)


My Megasquirt has cam and crank input and I can fully map the ignition up to 4 bar boost.

yes, as soon as I have updates, Ill also update here. thanks for your interest.

 

Look what the mailman brought in yesterday. My up&forward headers came in the mail.



Damn these things are huge, compared to my stock cast iron manifolds. hahaha.
I have a couple other projects to attent to first, but cant waite to get started on this build.
But first I need to finish my garage extension. So I can work inside next winter.
Then finish the Suburban of my wife. She hasnt driven it in 3 years now.
And I think Ill save the turbo project for after summer, when the car goes inside.
I really wanna enjoy drivingt it, when all this Covid stuff relaxes a little hopefully.

 

Something thts pretty cool is we are in a very cold period for out standards here in the Netherlands. And it was s good time to test my cold starting on LPG injection. Normal modern cars warm up on gasoline and I have taken the gasoline completely out.

Here is s video I made:

 

I got an email asking where I have been. Well havent been sitting quitly. Been busy finishing the garage extension (allmost done) so I can work inside this winter in a warm heated (underfloor heating) shop. Mancave allmost done!

And been collecting parts. Scored an Edelbrock Elbow #3849. So I can fit a LS style throttlebody when I install the turbo on the engine.


My injectors were giving me a hard time. They were maxing out at fullthrottle at sometimes well over 100% duty cycle and my LPG reducer was dropping supply pressure on full throttle runs. So I replaced the reducer by a new Tomasetto AT13XP reducer and that fixed the supply pressure. Its even a little higher on full throttle runs. Its the small new aluminium unit. The old one was rated 300hp and this smalle rnew one is rated 350hp. So enough for now. When I add the turbo Ill probably just add a second reducer.



Tried to drill out the injector nozzles to fix the max duty cycle problem and ran into all kinds of tuning problems. It would loose all power above 25% TPS for some reason. In the end I traced it down to the top part of the injector rail. I completely swapped the 3 ohm valtek top part fot the 2 ohm Femitec. That fixed it. The nozzles are currently drilled to 3.04mm and I have about 70% duty cycle at full throttle at max shift (around 4500rpm).


For my birthday I asked my wife a ride on a dyno to get a baseline of the car and engine naturally aspirated. Im really curious if it makes the 250hp it should have from factory or more, since I added the better intake and cam and road-tuned the ignition and fuel really well in my opinion.

Ill report back here when I have the dyno sheet

 

Jochen, PLEASE, I can't stress this enough, but make sure your fuel system is sorted and you have plenty of fuel available at the injectors before ever getting into boost. Maxing out injector duty cycle and pressure dropping below par with a naturally aspirated motor will cause you to drive home, replace some parts in the fuel system and re-tune your car. Do the same with a boosted motor and you'll tow the car home and rebuild an engine. It happens so fast, it's like the flick of a switch. Ask me how I know.

 

I know Alain. I have heard that from a lot of people. I had lean spikes on throttle change from not yet tuning the Accelerator Enrichment and thus wanted to see how I need to tune that. And also had to make sure that drilling out the injectors would result in lower duty cycle. And it did.

Next stop now is a dyno session. Found Jarna van Haren. But its allmost 2h drive over to him. But he also knows my Megasquirt ECU, so while on the dyno he can hopefully helpme tune a little.

when I get the baseline down. Ill have a nice take off point for further upgrades, which of course will need me to open up the injectors even further and maybe adding a second reducer for more LPG supply. We'll see...but dont worry...when installin the turbo I wont be going full blast right of the bat ;-)

 

So how'd the Dyno go??

 

thanks for asking. Its planned for the 19 of november. Im so excited to find out what the baseline of this old low compression big block is and if how good I have road tuned it so far. Ill report back here.